Our Dead Dads
The concept of Our Dead Dads was born through the daily discussions of seven men who share bonds of blood, friendship and all having lost their fathers. Nick Gaylord, the show’s host, shares his life experiences with his deceased father while exploring the complications and realities of that relationship. Life is intense, grief and loss come in many forms, and no parent-child relationship is black and white, which is why this show touches on all shades of grey.
Join Nick for candid conversations with his three brothers and three of his lifelong friends, along with other special guests who discuss their experiences with loss, grief, laughter, and moving forward. Nothing is off-limits here. Nick learned after his father's passing that he couldn't process what he was going through alone and sought the help of a therapist, who helped him to let go of his anger toward his father. Looking back, he realized just how many people are being crushed under the weight of grief, loss, and in some cases, anger.
Nick's mission through Our Dead Dads is to offer a platform for anyone who needs or wants to tell their story, to have that opportunity. He also hopes to reach many more who need to talk but don't know how to start the conversation, hopeful that by listening to these stories, they will be able to start talking with someone.
Nick has always sought to help others and to make everyone around him laugh. Along with his brothers and friends, he has frequently used humor to get through the hardest times in their lives, and hopefully, you will permit yourself to do the same. Get ready for an emotional deep dive. Nick has a lot to say and so do his guests. He's here for you and ready to help. Everyone has been through trauma, grief, and loss. Now, along with Nick and his guests, everyone will get through it together.
Nick is changing the world one damaged soul at a time. Welcome to Our Dead Dads.
Our Dead Dads
027 - Embracing Emotions and Rebuilding After Loss with Kyle Jetsel
Have you ever wondered how to navigate the turbulent waters of grief while maintaining a sense of family stability? Kyle Jetsel joins us, sharing his powerful journey through the loss of both his father and his wife of thirty years. Through Kyle's candid reflections, we explore the impact of embracing emotions, the importance of community support, and the societal pressures men face in expressing their feelings. This episode touches on the transformative power of vulnerability, humor, and community in healing from loss.
Parenting, as Kyle and I discuss, is an ongoing lesson in accountability and grace. A pivotal moment for me was when my wife, managing our four sons, adopted a mindset of "100% AG"—complete accountability tempered with abundant grace. This approach not only transformed her but inspired me to follow suit, leading to a family dynamic based on kindness and understanding rather than guilt. Through personal anecdotes, I recount the invaluable wisdom imparted by my father, whose lessons in resilience and perseverance continue to influence my approach to life's challenges.
Storytelling emerges as a recurring theme—both as a means of processing grief and as a tool for creating connections. Kyle and I delve into how sharing experiences can foster empathy and understanding, underscoring that true strength lies in embracing our vulnerabilities and extending compassion to others. We wrap up by highlighting small acts of kindness and community support that can make a profound impact, reminding us that we are never alone in our struggles. Join us in this heartfelt episode as we explore the power of love, storytelling, and community in finding purpose and strength after loss.
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Hello and welcome to Our Dead Dads, the podcast where we normalize talking about grief, trauma loss and moving forward. I'm your host, my name is Nick Gaylord, and if this is your first time joining me, then welcome to the show. If you're a regular listener, welcome back. For everybody listening, thank you so much for the support and thank you for making this show part of your day. The best way that you can continue to support the show is by listening, sending in your feedback to the show's Facebook and Instagram pages and, most importantly, please spread the word about the show. Everybody deals with grief. We are all in this together and the best thing that any of us can do is to support each other through that grief. Follow us on your favorite listening platform, give us a five-star review and, by the way, if you don't know how to leave a five-star review, go to the homepage of OurDeadDadscom, scroll down and you will find step-by-step instructions, the ratings, the downloads, spreading the word about the show. I really can't thank you enough. We're getting noticed in countries all over the world, so please keep it up. As you all know, I want to be a recognized voice in the grief community, and the more the word spreads about this podcast, the more folks I can help. I really hope you enjoyed last week's conversation with Nicole Maitland.
Speaker 1:This week is episode 27, and Kyle Jetzel is here to discuss losing his father and his wife of 30 years. Kyle has no qualms about diving into the tough questions or letting his emotions show. Kyle is a loving, dedicated father of six with children ranging in age from 30 down to 16-year-old twins. We're going to get into the stories of how his dad tried every get-rich-quick idea in the book and probably invented a few more along the way, and how Kyle initially resented his dad for it but ultimately embraced how happy it made him to live the life he did. Nothing is off-limits today, as we talk about raising six children and then going from finding out his wife was sick to losing her within just 10 days. Buckle up for what is sure to be another emotional conversation. Before we get started, I would like to thank you again for listening, for your feedback and for engaging with the show. Please don't forget to follow the show's social media pages on Facebook, instagram and TikTok.
Speaker 1:As you know, my goal is to normalize talking about grief, loss and trauma, which are topics that are not easy for most of us to talk about, but they are also topics that everybody should be discussing more Not only discussing them, but not feeling like they are taboo topics. Time may not heal all wounds, but keeping everything bottled up inside does not heal any of them. Together, we are building a community for others to have a safe space to talk about their stories and their feelings, and for anyone who may not yet be ready to talk, just to listen to others and know that nobody is alone in this path. That is why I say we are a community and I'm so happy to have you here. If you have a story of grief and loss to share and might want to be considered as a future guest on Our Dead Dads, go to OurDeadDadscom, go to the Contact Us link and then select Be a Guest, fill out the form, send it in and you just might be able to tell your story and carry on this mission of helping ourselves and helping so many others. And now we're ready to get started.
Speaker 1:So let's welcome Kyle to the show. Please enjoy this episode and stick around for the end when I will tell you about next week's episode. How you doing, nick? So good to see you again. I'm great. How are you? I'm doing good, so sorry for the delay. I did not anticipate that happening. It happens, unfortunately. This has been the story of today, but now we're at the best part of today, because I get to see your beautiful face. You'd be shocked how often I hear that.
Speaker 2:Well, not enough never to hear it, never, yeah, that might have been the only time.
Speaker 1:I don't know if I could believe that. Well, you're here, I'm here, everybody's here, no more delays. What do you say? We have a little bit of fun, and of course, by fun I mean we're going to talk about shit. That's really going to be upsetting and emotional. No problem, I'm ready that.
Speaker 1:I follow you on Facebook. I see a lot of the posts that you put up on social media and I know that you are a man of many emotions and, honestly, that's one of the things I love about you you are not afraid to let it show. And that's not that I'm ever looking to have a conversation that's going to upset you, because you've been through this, you have been living this for quite a while and you're just, you're an emotional guy, and that's not a bad thing because, honestly, men need to cry more often. Men need to be able to experience their feelings, be in touch with their feelings and not run away from them, not hide from them, as you and I know all too well, too many men run away from everything, well, don't get it twisted Nick.
Speaker 2:I mean, if I need to, I could drop you like a sack of dirt. I just want you to know that.
Speaker 1:Oh, I know that, I know that and I'm not expecting it. Hopefully I'm on your good side tonight and we're going to have a little bit more on the fun side instead of just being dropped like a sack of dirt. But I also know that you could do that if you need to.
Speaker 2:The good news is everybody's on my good side, right. There's really nobody that really gets on my bad side typically. So, yeah, it's not something I even have to entertain anymore, although I still. I know it's in there because I feel it come up sometimes right now to manage it.
Speaker 1:That's okay. Look, it's in there for all of us. I have bad days, you have bad days. You're allowed to have bad days. We all are. It's just a matter of what we do with it. When it decides to rear its ugly face, so we kick its ass and we tell it to fuck off for a little while because we've got other things to do and it can come back later and bother us, and it usually does.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it'll always come back. I tell my kids we've all got to visit those places. But we don't want to live there. We don't want to live there.
Speaker 1:We don't want to live there, right, and so it's healthy to live there.
Speaker 2:It's important for us to manage those. When those things do happen, it's important for us to manage them so that we can be at our best when we need to be at our best and then, occasionally, we can go down that rabbit hole and experience that some of that pain and suffering that we all have to face, so exactly.
Speaker 1:Yep, you know I can't say this from personal example because I don't have any kids, but somebody a couple of months ago told me that grief is like children you can never get rid of them.
Speaker 2:You know, if you I'll, you know, I'll share with you something. I think it's pretty funny that you said that. You know, years ago my wife and I told my kids and they know this, they still know this I said if we're all on a boat and the boat is sinking and I can choose, all six of you kids or my wife, y'all are going to die. And she would say don't tell them that. Don't tell. And I would say you know what they need to know, that you're a level above the rest of them altogether, right? I said that doesn't mean I don't love them, right, but what it does do, and I saw this over the years.
Speaker 2:I saw that them knowing that she was more important to me than all of them. It gave them comfort, it made them feel a certain way and that way was dad loves mom. And you know I'm not going to be able to. You know, and kids can be tricky. They try all kinds of different ways to get what they want and that doesn't mean they won't use each other, use you against each other as parents.
Speaker 1:Oh, they totally do Good cop, bad cop.
Speaker 2:So you saying that it's interesting, and my kids are older now, right, my oldest is 30, and my youngest? I have 16-year-old twins, a boy and a girl, and I just wrote recently about how they're my best friends. Now it doesn't mean that I still don't have to discipline my 16-year-olds and the kids that live with me. What it does mean, though, is that they understand that process. They understand that I love them and I've got their best interest at heart, and hopefully I'm not being hypocritical in the way I. You know, it's one thing to say something, it's another way to be someone, right?
Speaker 2:And so I'm always real cautious about how I act and what they see in me, because I know if they see, you know, see some contradictory things, they're going to challenge me and frankly they have, and that's okay for me. If they see I'm talking one way and doing something a different way, they're going to talk to me about it. My kids are and I appreciate that at this point.
Speaker 1:Right, it's good to be held accountable by anybody, even if it's by your kids. The last thing that anybody ever wants to be or wants to be seen as is being hypocritical, and if you say something that's a little bit contradictory, it's not like you're trying to be a hypocrite. Sometimes you just it happens. So that's why we have people who keep us in check. But it's okay, even if it's coming from your kids. That's a good thing. The fact that you have that close relationship with all of your kids, that's incredible, because there's so many people some people that I've spoken with who don't have great relationships with their kids, people that I know in my life, people that I'm sure you know who don't have a close relationship with their children or with their parents. And the fact that you have six kids and you have that closeness with all of them, that's incredible.
Speaker 2:You know, and I feel grateful that my dad kind of set that standard too.
Speaker 2:My dad was the model of that and my relationship with him was, I tell. You know, I tell stories about my dad sharing examples or saying my dad was really good about saying the right things in the right moments, right. And I think sometimes, you know, there's two sides to it. One is I think he was good at it and I think he looked for opportunities to create links to certain things that would help me as I grew up. But I also think I probably missed half of them anyway, because I was kind of a defiant kid, you know. So I would imagine it goes both ways and I imagine some of the stuff he said probably wasn't great and I probably have just ignored that and let it slide. I guess what I'm saying is, as parents and as individuals, we're all going to say the wrong things and do the wrong things in certain situations and hopefully we have relationships around us that are the kind that will forgive us when we're stupid, right and then pump us up when we do the right things Right exactly.
Speaker 1:We all have those moments. We all do stupid things. We can't let everything be about a little mistake, especially if it is just a little mistake. Look, we all are going to make mistakes. Hopefully they're not so serious that we're going to ruin anything ruin a good relationship, ruin a job, ruin whatever it may be. Hopefully we don't make those kinds of mistakes, but they're going to happen.
Speaker 2:Sure, my wife was famous for saying you know, there were years where my kids, all my kids, were kind of challenging, especially early on. I had four sons in a row and my wife was very feminine and kind and sweethearted and I was kind of the opposite growing up. And so when my first four boys showed up, they were feral, they were animals. And she was like what in the crap? Nothing works with these crazy stinking animals, right? And I remember she would lose her temper or she would, right, there's things we all do as parents, right. And I remember, over a period of time, watching her go from really kind of angry and frustrated consistently to kind of changing and kind of going back to her real self, which I like to call feminine and beautiful, right and kind and sweethearted. And I said what's going on? I'm watching you change Like a metamorphosis, yeah. And she said you know what? I realized something. She said these kids are going to challenge me all the time and she said I'm going to make mistakes and I'm going to yell at them and I'm going to chase them down and whoop them. And I remember one day I came home and there was tension in the home and and she, my two, two of my sons, were in the backyard calling each other names. You know how kids do and that wasn't her way, right, that wasn't the way my wife was. And there was such tension in the home. And I came home and she was just you could tell it was eating her alive. She was just, she thought I shouldn't have done that. And she said, over a period of time she realized that she wasn't going to be perfect and the kids shouldn't expect her to be perfect. And she said she came up with a strategy. She called 100% AG is what she called it? Okay. And she said she came up with a strategy. She called 100% AG is what she called it, okay. I said what is 100% AG? And she said 100% accountability and a whole lot of grace. That's the G right.
Speaker 2:And she said once she started doing that with herself when she would make a mistake, and she would sit back when the emotion had subsided and she would look at the situation. She would say you know, I didn't handle that well. And she would take accountability. And she would even go to the kids and say you know what I didn't handle that well. Your kids being kids, your boys, you know jumping over fences and smashing your bikes and the stuff, and that's kind of normal, but you know it wasn't normal for her. And she said so I'm going to take accountability for not handling it well. And then she would just forgive herself, she would just give herself grace and go right back. She said because what can happen and I think this happens to all of us if we continue to make the same mistake, we feel like we'll never get it and we give up. And once you give up, you're in trouble. And she said I never want to give up trying to do the right thing for my kids or for you or for anybody. And so it was interesting to watch her.
Speaker 2:The more she would took accountability for what she did and the more she forgave herself quickly instead of spiraling down that rabbit hole of guilt and shame. Right, and I think it taught me a lesson as well, because I adopted it immediately Right, I would come home and she would be pulling her hair out and I would say you kids are grounded for a year. Right, and I'm, you know how it's standard stuff, right, yeah, and I wouldn't handle it. Well. And then and I started using that 100% AG, 100% accountability and a whole lot of grace and I would realize you know that wasn't a good way to handle it and I would go back to the kids and I'd say I didn't handle it well and you're not grounded for the whole year. You know, we're going to figure this out.
Speaker 2:And what it did too is. It softened me a little bit too, because it made me realize there's a you know, when you, when you lead your kids, and when you lead I think when you lead anything with fear or shame or guilt, the people around you feel controlled and they'll want to escape, right, and I didn't want my kids to want to escape me feel controlled and they'll want to escape, right, and I didn't want my kids to want to escape me. But the flip side to that is when you lead with kindness and love and compassion and patience, people feel empowered, yes, and they want to do better, right. And I kind of look back to my dad. I remember I'll share a story with you about my dad specifically I remember I was about 11 years old and I was playing in a baseball game and that was my life. At 11 years old, I thought I was going to be a professional baseball player, right? You know how? We all have these dreams.
Speaker 1:Oh sure, I thought I was going to be at 1.2.
Speaker 2:There you go.
Speaker 1:Yeah, lasted for about nine seconds, but still the dream was there.
Speaker 2:Right, right.
Speaker 2:And so you know, there's two outs in the final inning and somebody hits the ball to me and I made an error and the next couple of guys got hits. We lost, they won All my fault. All I had to do was make one play. And I remember going over to my dad after the game and I was distraught this is my life at this point. And I said you know what, dad, I wish they hadn't hit the ball to me because then we could have won.
Speaker 2:And I remember my dad got down. He kneeled down on my level so he could look at me eye to eye. And he said you know what, kyle, that's not how we do things in this life. You don't ever want to pass your success or failures to anybody else. He said I know you're working hard. I see you taking grounders, I see you trying. He said you want to work so hard, excuse me that you want every ball. Every game hits you, sorry. And he said you don't want to go down ever. If something is important, don't you ever go down without the biggest fight you can give. That's right, right. And when you're 11 and your dad says that to you and you know your dad is your hero at that time. Right, like you know what I can do that.
Speaker 2:And he said you're going to fail at a lot of things. You're going to succeed at a lot of things, don't you ever? You want to take the last shot every game, you want to get every ball, every game. He said you prepare yourself so you're ready. And throughout my life I've had, you know, not just in sports, but in situations where things seemed overwhelming, or work situations or career situations. You know, you don't want to shy away, you want to step into it and you want to say I want to work and study and grow so that I'm capable and if I fail, I can learn from that failure and move forward in the right direction. Right, and it's okay. It's okay to make those mistakes and fail periodically, and actually we're probably going to fail more than we succeed. But it only takes one good success to make up for a whole lot of failure Right, that's right.
Speaker 1:I love that tell me some more about your dad he sounds like he was quite an inspirational force in your life yeah, my dad.
Speaker 2:You know I'll, because my wife was kind of shy and quiet and that's not my personality at all. Obviously I'm type a aggressive. I can't wait to talk to people. I'm very social. I remember when we first got married she would kind of reign me in a little bit right, and I needed it for sure, because I was a little too out there. Right, you probably shouldn't walk around disciplining other people's kids that you don't know, right? I mean that's an extreme.
Speaker 1:You know what, if their parents aren't disciplining them, somebody has to.
Speaker 2:You would think so, but not my place. I shouldn't have been right, but I remember when my dad passed away. I remember we went to his funeral and at his funeral there was this overriding theme of my dad I'll share with you. My dad was a get rich quick guy, but he never got rich. He would jump from one multi-level marketing to when the internet got big. He jumped on board that and everything was just this is it? This is the one that's going to make me rich, right? And so he did it his whole life.
Speaker 2:And I'll never forget, when I was probably I don't know I was in my mid 30 years or so, when I had a couple of kids and I was doing pretty well in my career, I get a call from my dad and he says and he said I want you to join me in this one. And at that point I'd seen so many failures. I'm like come on, dad. I said you've done this your whole. I mean I can't count on both hands and both feet. How many times you've done this? And why do you keep doing this? When are you going to learn that get rich quick doesn't work?
Speaker 2:And he got quiet for a second and then he said. And then I could almost hear him smile over the phone and he said to me what's the worst thing that can happen? I die trying. That's what he said. Right, and initially I was frustrated because I thought that is the stupidest thing I've ever heard you know. But then I sat back and thought about it and I thought you know what ever heard you know? But then I sat back and thought about it and I thought you know what? His pursuit of getting rich, it drove him and it made him happy and it made him buoyant and it made him full of life and energy and he was good and kind to people around him because he was always. He had this goal, pursuant that he just it kept him happy.
Speaker 1:It was his fire.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it lit him up and he was able to spew that happiness on everybody everywhere he went. Okay, and I thought you know what? If something lights you up, it gives you, or it's a valiant thing and you can make it valiant, right, it doesn't matter if you never succeed at it, as long as you keep trying. It keeps you buoyant and happy. Who cares if you die trying? That sounds like a success, right?
Speaker 2:I remember at his funeral there were a lot of people up there talking about him and they were just talking about how he brightened them. And I had people I met that said who are you? And I said I'm Kyle Jetson. And they said, are you Jerry's son? And I said yeah, and they would say, oh my gosh, I love him. And they would hug me and squeeze me and you could tell he changed their life somehow. Right, yeah, and I remember at the funeral my wife was sitting there listening to this and just hearing about how he left a lake of happiness everywhere he went and that was his legacy. His legacy was he never made any money, but he left people happier.
Speaker 1:He never had the monetary wealth, but it sounds like he had a wealth of personality to share.
Speaker 2:And he was just this guy who, yeah, and I remember we were coming driving back from his funeral and my wife turned to me and she said you know what? You have that in you. And I think I've been holding you back from it because I've been worried that I was going to be embarrassed or I didn't want the attention. She said you know what you got? To go get them. That's something that you can do too. If he can do it with no money, you can do it too, right? And so she basically said go get them. And she said if I'm uncomfortable I'll just turn and walk away.
Speaker 2:She said but I want you to bring that part of you back out, because imagine that, imagine you leave a legacy of happy, buoyant people. When somebody hears your name, they light up yeah Right, that's your legacy. Holy crap, if I have to choose a legacy, that's the one I'm choosing. That's a pretty phenomenal legacy to leave Over and above anything else, right, and that's really what my dad did. I can see the way over and above anything else, right, and that's really what my dad did. And so you know, I think the lesson for me was I mean, if we have the ability to just gently touch somebody.
Speaker 2:And again, my dad was also famous for saying half the world is going to love you and half the world is going to hate you, right? So so let the lovers love and the haters hate. Do what you do, right? That's what you say, right? But the half that loved him, they weren't just acquaintances, they loved him, they were. Their lives were better because of him. And so you know, as I look at what I'm trying to do or what I're out and about, if you see something good, say it right. If you're in a grocery store and there's, you know, just recently I was over at the grocery store and there was a little kid in the basket just screaming and yelling and his mom was being so patient and you could see she didn't want to be in the grocery store with him screaming and yelling, and he was at a young enough age where she's trying to teach him right, and if she just goes home he doesn't learn.
Speaker 1:So she was going to Accountability and grace.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I just walked up to her and I say you know, I got to tell you there's people in here looking at you cross. I said I'm looking at you glowingly. I think you're doing exactly what you should. Don't you pay any attention to these people that are looking at you cross what you should? Don't you pay any attention to these people that are looking at you cross?
Speaker 2:You're teaching this boy by not giving into what he wants. It's going to teach him discipline and I admire you for that and I admire you for your patience. I'm watching you and you're killing it. Mom, keep up the good work, right? And she just teared up and she's like what? And I said you got to know, somebody's got to tell you that I see what's happening and I want you to know you're doing the right thing and I love it. And you got to know that. Right, and it doesn't take much just for a simple compliment or a kind word to somebody and it's really easy to do, but it makes a huge difference for people to hear that in those moments.
Speaker 1:But it's also just as easy to not do, and a lot of people even if there were other people nearby that may have had the same or similar thoughts to what you had there are a lot of people who are not going to go up to her and say what you said because they might think, oh, I'm being too invasive or I'm crossing a line, or whatever the thought may be. There are a lot of people who will view that situation from a distance, whether they judge, whether they admire, but still they won't say anything. The fact that you went up and said that to her and then she got emotional look at the impact it made.
Speaker 2:You know what I think? That again, I'm going to put that right at the feet of my dad, right, just hearing how he impacted people's lives and saying you know what I can do that I can give somebody a simple compliment and guess what?
Speaker 2:I've had people turn on me. They weren't happy to hear it, and again that's going to happen periodically. Of course it will. But the other thing that I always try to implement when I do that kind of stuff and I do it often, by the way it makes me feel good too To see them. My wife used to call me a productive narcissist. What did she?
Speaker 1:mean by that?
Speaker 2:That's what I said. What do you mean by that? She said well, you know that by doing things for other people, it's going to make you feel good. She said so, you're always doing things for other people, but it's really all about you. She said but I know you're doing it for the right reasons and for other people, but it's still about you. And she would always put I say you know, there's a little bit of truth to that. Right, there's a little bit of truth to that, because, whether she was gracious or not about it in her response, I still knew I had made a good decision in what I did, and I want to make good decisions and I want to try to do those things.
Speaker 2:More often than not, when you give somebody a compliment, they do take it the right way, and my wife was also very good about teaching me. She said when you approach a stranger and this is my wife's words if you do it in a spirit of love, it changes the way you say things and do things and it changes your demeanor. Yes, it does. And I have this problem because I'm not a small man and so when I approach somebody, if I approach them in the wrong way, it can feel a little threatening. And so she said put yourself in a state of love and approach them in a spirit of love. And when I did that, it softens me right, and it people can almost feel that. And then if I don't use the right words or I use them a little crooked, they come across differently, they sound differently and it requires me to think how would I say this if I'm saying it in a spirit of love, right, right, and that's really the powerful message is, if you see good, say it and tell them in a spirit of love and people will respond. They generally will respond positively.
Speaker 2:Yes, and I'm also all about the story, nick. I love stories, obviously I love stories?
Speaker 1:Yes, you do, and this is one of the things I love about you so much you are all about the story.
Speaker 2:I am about the story. One of my favorite stories about my dad is when I was growing up in the late 70s, early 80s.
Speaker 1:I grew up in Dallas, texas and we used to drive down to Beaumont which is down on the Gulf Coast.
Speaker 2:Back then in the late 70s the speed limit was 55 on the interstates and we had an old beat up junker car. Remember we were a get rich quick that never got rich. So we had this car, that just a beat up junker, and every summer we'd drive down to see our family in Beaumont and it was a six hour drive in the blistering heat of Texas summer Right. And every summer we would break down. Sometimes we'd drive out of Dallas two hours and we'd break down, sometimes four we'd break down, but it seems like every trip we made we broke down on the way down there. Now the good news was that in Beaumont my Uncle, mike, was a mechanic, so he would drive up and he would fix our car with bailing, wire and coat, hangers and whatever and duct tape and we would drive down to Beaumont and then they would spend the whole time fixing my dad's car and making sure it could make the ride back Right. Well, after about the third or fourth time of us breaking down, I'll never forget I'd walked up to my dad and we're on the side of the road and the blistering summer heat. You know, I said Dad, why do we keep doing this. You know we're going to break down. And my dad said something that changed my life forever and he said you know what, kyle, it's just a trip until something goes wrong. Then it's an adventure. And I was like what he's like? He said you know, what do you guys do when we break down? And here's what was interesting. As I look back, I don't remember what we did in Beaumont with our family, but when we were broke down, I remember going with my brothers fishing in a pond illegally. We had a cow pie fight one time. Another time we went hunting with rocks and slingshots and almost got a deer. I mean, every time we broke down I remember those moments because they were off script and they were unusual and weird and we had to make up our story in those moments, right. And so as I got older, I realized, you know, we can go weeks or sometimes even months and days just pass and there's nothing unusual or weird or memorable about any of that time, but when something goes wrong, we remember it right Now.
Speaker 2:How do we remember? It is the question. Do we make it an adventure when something goes horribly wrong in our life? Do we say, oh my gosh, I can't wait till this is over. You know I'm going to die. When this is over, everything will be fine again. Or do we say, now it's an adventure and I get to now things, I remember it. Am I going to remember it as a moment where you know I've shot, you know, rocks at deer with slingshots and hunted and threw cow pies? Or am I going to remember it as pain and suffering? Because it can be either, depending on how we look at that situation and so it's something I've taught my kids as we've, as they've grown up. I said, oh, and things are happening and something goes horribly wrong and I'm like, hey, now it's an adventure, right, you're going to remember this. How are you going to remember it? What spirit are you going to take into it so that you can remember it? Fun, or you remember it as pain and suffering.
Speaker 2:I choose fun, you get to choose what you want, and a lot of times, even the hard times, when you look back on them years later to choose what you want, and a lot of times, even the hard times, when you look back on them years later you tell the story with a smile generally.
Speaker 2:So why not, in the moment, try to make it what it can be, all that it can be right, and see it. And my dad was just the king of that right. We'd break down on the side of the road. He'd somehow or another make it fun or figure out a way for it to be a memorable experience, and it was because he was thoughtful enough to realize. This is the moment we're on the side of the road in Texas. This is the moment where my kids are going to have memories and they're going to be memories as a family. How are we going to do it? Are we going to complain and gripe and are we going to create a game out in the pasture chasing cows? Whatever we do, what a great way to look at and experience life through that lens of adventure.
Speaker 1:You know, there's a movie that I'm thinking of. That's kind of wraps into what you're talking about, and a lot of people might not know this, because half of this story was not in the original movie. It was one of the deleted scenes. You've probably seen the movie the Day After Tomorrow Dennis Quaid, jake Gyllenhaal. That was probably one of Jake Gyllenhaal's first movies.
Speaker 1:Once the big blizzard took over and Jake Gyllenhaal and everybody else was stuck in the library in New York City. He was having a conversation with Emmy Rossum about what his favorite vacation was other than that one, of course and he was talking about a story where his dad was on I don't know if it was a fishing boat or whatever boat it was on, but the boat broke down and they were stuck on the boat for 10 days and he said it was the best time ever because it was just him and his dad for 10 days. Now, the other half of that story. Unless if there are people out there who have seen the deleted scenes either, when we all had DVDs, you can go watch the deleted scenes. I used to actually do that once in a while and I watched the deleted scenes and one of them was Dennis Quaid and the other guy that was on the hike with him, or the drive which turned into a hike hike with him, or the drive which turned into a hike when the eye of the storm got close and he had to shove him down into that building or whatever. They had to stay warm. And after the guy woke up, they were having a conversation and Dennis Quaid was reflecting on that very same trip and he said that Sam, his son, probably hated it because it was boring and they were just stuck out there for 10 days and couldn't do anything. So they had two opposite perspectives of the same exact story. Because he was worrying that he was going to be disappointing his son and the son was like this was the most incredible time ever.
Speaker 1:So it is all. And I know like why am I bringing up this movie? But that's exactly why, because it's all about perspective. You can either say this is a shitty time. We were stuck out on the open water for 10 days in a boat with no power and we couldn't do anything or we could say, yeah, I was with my dad for 10 days and I didn't have to worry about anything and I had the best damn time.
Speaker 1:It is all about perspective. I love that you have that perspective, that your dad gave you that perspective, because you could have been the exact opposite. You could have been the negative one. You could have been thinking about all of the reasons why something sucks, and my dad was like that. He would always find the negative in everything and after a while it's just like dude, shut the fuck up. Think of something positive for a change, like why do you have, why does everything have to be negative? He just couldn't help himself, he couldn't get out of his own way. I love that your dad gave you the exact opposite perspective, even when he was trying all the get rich quick schemes and never got rich, never made the money. But he never lost his perspective. He never lost that thing that so many of us just never have.
Speaker 2:You know, that's interesting that you bring up the two different perspectives, right? And what I see in you, nick, is your dad going maybe the other route in some cases and you saying, shut up, right, it's interesting how because I've got a few brothers and they were on those same trips with me, by the way, same dad, same trips, same experience that have, look at it, negative still, isn't that crazy? Yeah, and they're my brothers, same dad, and the point is it wasn't my dad that made the choice for all of us. My dad made the choice for my dad and invited me to come along. He also invited my brothers to come along, and one specifically did not. He wasn't having it right, whereas your dad had a more negative approach to it and, without even knowing it, he invited you to come along with his negativity and you chose the opposite. Right, you said, shut up, it's interesting how two people can come from the same world and they're a simple perspective choice and run them in different happiness directions, right, yeah, I mean, my wife used to say, and I'll never forget, we came across this couple.
Speaker 2:You know how you go out with different couples. Sometimes your wife will like the lady and sometimes you'll like the man and it's hard to find ones where you both like both, right, right. Sometimes we're just patient with our spouses and they're patient with us because we have friends. But I remember we went out with a couple and I liked the dude. He was a cool dude and I thought this is going to be a good couple for us to hang out with.
Speaker 2:And I didn't notice that the lady was kind of not that way. She was a little bitter and angry and when we got back she said well, we're not going out with him again. I said what are you talking about, man? And she said listen, bitter, angry people live in a bitter, angry world and happy, loving people live in a happy, loving world. And it's the same world. She said I'm not going to live in somebody else's bitter, angry world If they are not generally happy.
Speaker 2:And I understand problems and I'm not saying you have to be bubbly all the time, but I'm saying if you've created a world that you live in that's bitter and angry, that's you right and I'm not living in that world. So we're not doing that again, kyle, and I'm like you know what? How powerful is that to realize same world, like there's people out there who are walking around just looking for trouble and angry and bitter all the time, and they live in the same world I do, somehow or another. I live in this world of happiness and joy and kindness, and I feel like I'm surrounded by great people. Right, that's how I feel.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And that that person over there is living in the same world I am, and somehow they've created a bubble of that. Right, yeah, and I think it just goes back to choice. How are you choosing to see things and what you focus on and what you look for is you're going to find Right, and so we all need checks and balances. Right, we absolutely do, we all do, all of us do, and I think that's why you know, and checks and balances, like you said, can be, they can be either side, right, we can grow up in a world.
Speaker 2:I've got good buddies of mine who grew up without a father, who have decided to be the greatest fathers in the world. Right, and their check and balance was growing up in that situation and going. You know what I'm changing this and even no father in their life was a check and balance for them. They realized what they missed. Or, you know, and some others who didn't have fathers are in trouble, right, right, because they just ran down the same path, maybe the same path, you know, but again, we can get checks and balances from all over the place, absolutely, you know, but certainly we want to be the kind of men that add joy to people's lives, if we can. You know, I think I don't know if we talked about this the last time, you know I chatted, but one of my favorite sayings of all time is I was reading about this producer, one of the guys who worked on the Marvel movies yeah, and he said the interesting thing about the Marvel movies is that the heroes and the villains have the same backstory.
Speaker 1:Yes, we did talk about this, yeah, Tell it again because I love the first time.
Speaker 2:He says it's so great because the villain grows up in a tough situation and is hurt and is abused in some way or another. And the villain grows up and says you know what the world hurt me, I'm going to hurt it back. And it makes people villainous, he said. The hero, though, grows up in the same situation. Something happens, maybe their lives are hard, they're put in tough situations, maybe abusive, and they grow up and they say you know what the world hurt me, I'm going to save everybody I can from that pain. And it's really the difference in the hero and the villain is not how they got there, it's the choices they make to protect and how they think about that. Right, it's how you choose to save or to add to that, to drag people into that misery or to save people, right, and that's the difference in the hero and the villain.
Speaker 2:And sometimes we have to check ourselves and we say wait a minute. And this happens to all of us, right, with people we work with or neighbors or we associate with. You know, maybe we're driving home and somebody cuts us off on the road. Are we a hero or are we a villain? Right, right, and it's really easy to be a villain and that's, you know, the masculinity and the ego starts to, the heat starts to rise and it's really easy to step into that villain role.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, but it takes, you know it takes. I think, personally, it takes a little bit more strength as a man to push that down and say you know what? I don't know their situation, maybe they didn't mean to cut me off, I'm just going to give them a pass and I'm going to stay happy and I'm not going to retaliate and I'm just going to. Maybe I back off so that other people can get in easier and I'm a little bit more courteous as a driver, right, but we make those simple little decisions like that all the time and they're going to lead us to a path of spreading joy and happiness everywhere we go, or lead us down a path of the opposite, which is, I don't think any of us want to leave that legacy right.
Speaker 1:No, I don't think we do. But one of the problems with making little decisions like that is sometimes we're not even aware that we're making them, whether they're good or bad. They're so involuntary. But it's all about what way do you want to steer this? You, meaning the person, any person that we're talking to do you want to steer it in a positive way? Do you want to steer it in a negative way? Do you want to be the better person or do you want to be the aggressor? Do you want to be the guy who's gonna create the road rage? No, just let it go, it's not worth it?
Speaker 2:generally not, and you know what. You know what. I'll go back to what my wife said. Can you do that in a spirit of love? Can you road rage in a spirit of love? No, I can't. Well then you probably shouldn't be doing it. If you can't really road rage in a spirit of love, right that?
Speaker 1:was a horrible thing that you just did but it was a really good maneuver.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you squeezed in there tight. I mean I've seen NASCAR drivers that couldn't drive like that squeeze into that spot right there.
Speaker 1:I can see you being involved in a conversation with somebody after a road rage situation and ending up that you end up going to have drinks with the guy afterwards.
Speaker 2:You know what I had one years ago and I'll tell you about it.
Speaker 1:I was kidding one years ago and I'll tell you about it.
Speaker 2:No, it's really interesting because, you know, I've my wife made me realize early on because I grew up in a pretty tough world. I grew up in inner city Dallas, in what people would call the hood right, and the violence and the threat of violence was an effective weapon, way to negotiate through life, right. And so when we met she was so feminine, kind and beautiful and I'm like you know, I got to get some of that. I mean, I just need to because I'm living in an angry world. I'll never forget. We were watching TV one time and a story came on the news about some guy who had kidnapped this little girl and abused her. You know, and I'm watching this, I'm watching this news story and I'm starting to sweat because I'm so in, my hands are balled into fists, right, and my sweet wife comes up behind me. She puts her hand on my shoulder and she said are you OK? And I said if I ever catch, don't you let me catch that guy. You know, because I was enraged, right. Yeah, I wanted justice to be served, right. And she put. She so kindly put her hand on my shoulder. She said you know what, maybe you should focus on the family and have compassion for the family. And almost immediately I switched to that and I thought this feels so much better. This feels so much better, right, and I'm like I got to get some of that. Is that the way you see the world? Because I see it as violent and angry. And, right, I'm a man and I got to be tough and strong and I got to be a warrior in the garden. I can't be a gardener in the war. Right, I got to be a warrior in the garden, you know, right, and it made me realize that she was doing things in a different way, that I could adopt a lot of. It doesn't mean I'm not a man, it just means I have. I can look at things from a more compassionate, kind, loving way, you know.
Speaker 2:And it was shortly after this. I remember I had dropped my kids off at school one day and I came to a four-way stop and I was on the right-hand side and the other guy was on the left-hand side and we stopped at the same time. Well, legally, if two cars stop at a four-way stop sign at the same time, the guy on the right goes first. So I went first and the other guy was furious. He pulls around, he turns and he pulls around beside me. He starts driving alongside me and you know, I come from a world where you diagnose challenges very quickly.
Speaker 2:Right, and I look up and he's in a big giant truck and he's sitting way too close to the steering wheel and I'm thinking, brother, you don't want this man, I'm not to be trifled with. You're a small man in a big truck with a big problem. You might want to calm your freaking butt down. You know, this is what naturally goes through our minds without us even thinking. This is pattern, right.
Speaker 2:And as we drive and we're coming up to a stop sign, I think you know what Maybe I can look at this from my wife's angle, you know and so we come to the next stop and I rolled down my window and I could tell he thought it was about to go down. Right, and he rolls down his window and he's looking all angry and I said hey, bro, if I did something to upset you, I sure am sorry. I didn't mean to. And let me tell you, this guy went from ready to fight to his demeanor changed instantly and all I did was say hey, bro, if I did something to upset you. I sure am sorry, I didn't mean to and truthfully I didn't want to upset him, I wasn't trying to upset him. And his demeanor changed and he said oh well, that's okay, don't worry about it, man. And I was like and then we just drove off right, and I'm like holy crap. Well, here's what's interesting, nick, the very next day he must've dropped kids off at the school or something too. And it was near my home, because we came to the same stop sign at the same time the next day, me and the same guy in the same truck. And when I saw him I thought, well, I don't want to upset him. So I kind of said, go ahead, bro. And he was like oh no, you go, and we're best friends. All of a sudden I'm like holy crap. Just because I just checked my ego and just told him the truth, and now and after that I would see him periodically, we'd wave at each other, we were friends all because I just I didn't mean to, I just let him, I took my ego and just set it aside.
Speaker 2:It's amazing how quickly we can deescalate those kinds of situations when we, you know, when we feel attacked, we attack back. That's our natural tendency, all of us, somebody attacked even our wives, which is a big mistake. Your wife says why did you do that? And we attack back Right, that ain't never going to. But if we say, hey, tell me what's going on, babe, what happened? I can tell you're a little bit upset. If I did something wrong, I didn't. I'm not trying to upset you, you know. Tell me what, because I can fix this. I'm pretty good about fixing stuff. Tell me how. And it's funny, how, when we set our egos aside and when we're thoughtful about how we're working through these things, it changes us and it changes the world around us, right, you?
Speaker 2:mentioned it earlier, which I think is the greatest thing you can do is pattern recognition, right? Yes, is to recognize some of our patterns that we want to change and say you know what when my wife yells at me. I got a couple of options and I'm going to think through this when I'm calm, not in the middle of it, right?
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:You know that didn't go well with my wife. So I'm going to take 100% accountability and a whole lot of grace and I'm going to think through. Maybe next time she yells at me I'm going to just calmly take a different approach, right? But the cool part is we can do that with a lot of stuff in our lives is we can simply just take, just recognize patterns and if they happen multiple times, it makes it easier for us to say okay, when the heat of the moment is over, I can sit down and I can say you know what? This seems to be happening regularly. You know, maybe it's an argument with our wives, or maybe it's, you know, something at work or whatever it is that frustrates us or angers us or makes us discouraged. We can write it out and say what is it that's happening now? What is my natural pattern? What's a new pattern I can create that'll be better, more effective, more productive, more loving, more kind, and try that.
Speaker 2:And again, none of us gets it right all the time. I'm telling you, somebody cut me off the other day and I shot the finger at them. They didn't see, because I don't do that where people can see. I did it underneath, but it made me feel better somehow. But again, none of us is perfect. None of us is designed to be perfect. I'm not sitting here telling anybody they should be perfect or they will be perfect, and I'm not.
Speaker 2:But here's what I am saying Take accountability for it, Give yourself a lot of grace, Get. I am saying take accountability for it, Give yourself a lot of grace, Get back on the kindness wagon, Get right back on the wagon, right, Because you're going to keep messing up. Keep getting back on the wagon, Keep getting back on and maybe we can slowly change our patterns to where we're more reasonable and, you know, we're happier and kinder. How do I leave a legacy of that? How do I leave people happier than I found them right? That's really the message I think my dad had for me. Whether it was subconscious or not, I think that's the lesson that he left with me that's so powerful in my life.
Speaker 1:Tell me about losing your dad and how that affected you.
Speaker 2:So my dad faced a battle with cancer for about two years and it he went from a big man to withering away. And my dad didn't have an easy life, even though he was a happy fellow. He was faced with a lot of challenges in his life and I think when my dad passed away, you know I have a belief there's a life after this one, and I don't know what people's beliefs are, but that's mine. And when he passed away, I remember it didn't hurt me terribly, it made me, I had a sense, a feeling of he really put in a good life and now he can rest, you know, and that, and maybe I just created that for myself, to give me comfort in that moment. And so for me initially it was, it was just a comforting feeling that now he could and he didn't have to face all those, you know, the challenges of life, and I just felt like he did a good job, he was a good man and he did a good job and his reward is going to be great, you know. But here's what's interesting is I had a moment to be with him after he passed away and I was right there with him. It was just me and him. So I remember standing over my father and feeling like he was whatever he could do from the other side for me and my family. That was his concern and that was his mission. Now, right, and it was really a secondary comforting thing for me to feel like now I have this guardian angel right, or my dad could be some somehow. This, you know, and the and the lessons obviously the lessons that he left with me are still a huge player in my life Now.
Speaker 2:I think the toughest time for me was maybe six, eight months after he passed away and I couldn't call him anymore. Right, right, and I think I actually picked up the phone one day to call him and I'm like, holy crap, I can't call him. You know, and I remember it shaking me pretty bad. I think I hid in the pantry and I remember it shaking me pretty bad. I think I hid in the pantry, I think, because all my kids were. You know, when you've got kids around, you want to set an example of how to manage things well, and I think I broke down and it wasn't something I wanted, so you did it in the pantry.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, I went into the pantry and closed the door, okay, and I was in there and I was kind of falling apart, and after about 10 minutes, my wife she peeked in and I think she knew, and she came in and just stood by me and just comforted me Just, and I think, you know, that was the moment where I realized that I no longer had that physical presence of his Ask him questions and to get feedback, and to a big thing my dad did for me was he would tell me he was proud of me, or he would tell me that he loved my kids, or just the words that he would use. I couldn't hear those anymore, and it was a difficult thing for me to face that, and it shook me for a while. It took me a while for me to overcome those things.
Speaker 2:The beautiful thing about my father, though, is that so many of my memories of him are just the lessons and the smiles and the happiness and the joy that he spewed all over me. So when I think of my father now, I just immediately smile and I feel uplifted almost immediately. So that's another thing that I think we probably want to do for other people, right, when somebody thinks of us, that's what we want them to think of us. So if that's the way we want them to think of us, what do we do right? And my dad gave me a great model for those things.
Speaker 1:Thank you for sharing that. I appreciate that. I'm sure the listeners will appreciate that as well. Let's talk about your wife for a little while, if you don't mind, because I love seeing your Facebook posts. You are a family man.
Speaker 1:You have also, unfortunately, lost your wife. You put posts up all the time in her memory talking about her, talking about your kids. The post with a pair of shoes that I saw earlier today, I loved that. I'm sure this took a lot of time and probably a little bit of practice. You went from the guy who had to sneak into the pantry to find the box of pasta for 10 minutes and your kids weren't even aware of it because you didn't want them to see you upset to being the person who was not afraid to let emotion out. And look, you've been through a lot losing your dad, losing your wife, having six kids to raise by yourself. You're not afraid to show anything at this point, and maybe that is part of your close relationship with your children. Tell me about that. Tell me about your relationship with your wife. Tell me about how everything changed for you and your children after her passing.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I've mentioned her quite a few times and I always do, because she's such a big part of my life. But my wife and I were like any other marriage. I mean, we've gone through the ups and downs and difficulties and struggles. And I don't want somebody to think she and I hated the term soulmate. We thought it was silly, right, because if you get married you're going to face challenges as a couple, between each other, with kids. It's all part of the deal. But my wife and I, because we had strategized and worked together, we had solved problems together we learned pretty quickly that if we solve problems separately it was going to be a problem down the road and it never got solved. But when we worked together we were capable of a whole lot. And we had gone through a phase where our kids were so challenging that we weren't sure we were going to make it From that to having what we called the top 1% happy family and a top 1% happy marriage. And so I'll give you an example After we'd been married about 25 years, my wife and I went to change our bank, and when you move your money from one bank to another it's an ordeal.
Speaker 2:And so we go to this new bank and we're sitting in front of this little banker lady she's probably mid thirties or so and we're signing paperwork and doing all this stuff, and my wife and I are just chatting and, you know, doing what we do as a couple. And as we finished up, the lady turned to us and she said you know, can I ask you guys a question? And my wife said sure, and she said are you guys newlyweds? And my wife started laughing and she said no, we've been married 25 years. We have six kids. And the lady says I don't think. She said I've never seen a couple as happy as you two that hasn't been just recently married. My wife and I knew we were happy together and we worked at it. Right, we knew what we had. And some people would say well, how can you, how do you quantify a top one percent happy marriage? Well, I believed it and she believed it, and so it is right, that's the only two people that matter. Right, that's right, and so yeah, and so what ended up happening is, a couple of months after our 30th anniversary, my wife got sick and 10 days later she passed away suddenly. And so, yeah, 10 days she gets sick, she goes to the hospital. 10 days later she's gone and you know it's.
Speaker 2:I mean, initially I was worried for my kids. I didn't have time to focus on myself at all. I mean, certainly I needed to focus on myself. But, man, I read. I mean I went to work. I read that families get destroyed by tragedies like this. Happy families can be destroyed by a tragedy like this, and so I thought I'm not having that, we've worked too hard. My wife would want us to be happy, and so I went to work. I mean, I wrote out you and I talked about it when the emotion is away, writing out what are you going to do? How am I going to do this? What's my plan for each of my children, specifically to make sure they're okay. Two of them were married at the time, okay, and I had 13-year-old twins that were my youngest, so they're in middle school, right. And so I went to work just making sure that each of my kids I go out to dinner with each of my kids individually, once a month, even today, and it's almost been three years since they're passing to chat with them, to talk to them.
Speaker 2:Once my wife passed away, I realized I'm not a fan of suffering or pain. But I realized and I could push through almost anything as a man because I'm tough, I'm just and I have this mental, you know, I think and I think a lot of us are like that Ain't nothing I can't get through, I'll fight my way through anything. Well, when she passed away, after things got settled, I realized that this is not something I could manage and I realized that I couldn't tough my way through it. I had to. Sometimes, when the emotions got too big, I had to face that storm and I had to really let myself. You know, pain and suffering and sorrow and grief are all part of humanity and there's no way that I could just tough my way through and not experience those things. Right, and I realized that if I didn't allow myself to feel those things, that something probably was going to go wrong, real wrong, you know real quick Real, wrong real quick, real wrong, real quick.
Speaker 2:Before I would just tough my way through and I didn't have a lot of patience for people that couldn't tough their way through. And that's one thing I think has really changed for me is I remember on her one year anniversary, a couple of days prior to that, my oldest son called me and he said hey, dad, you know what day's coming up, don't you? I said, yeah, the anniversary of her death. He said what are you going to do? And I smiled and I said well, I think I'm just going to dive into the depths of hell for that day. And I said it with a smile, but I don't think he heard it that way and it scared him. And he said are you coming back? And I said, oh yeah, that's why I'm telling you what I'm doing, because I want you to call me about five o'clock in the afternoon that day and I'm taking a lifeline.
Speaker 2:I'm taking a couple of lifelines with me, but I realize I have to face that overwhelming storm right, and I'm a believer in God, so I believe I've got God on my side and so you know, I've always believed I had that lifeline. But sometimes when you dive in deep, it feels like the lifeline is gone, even though it's not Right, and so I think what really for me, what I've learned through this experience, is, as men, we have to be okay to feel every emotion. Again, that's part of the human experience. For us to deny, you know, any of those emotions is really going to be a problem, and that for years. That's what I did. I just said I'm not going there because that's not productive.
Speaker 2:I'm not having it, it's not productive. How's it going to help me? And I'm not doing it, and so I wouldn't. But after she passed away I realized that had to be part of my new reality. I used to think pain is inevitable, but suffering is a choice. I don't believe that anymore because I have suffered and I didn't have a choice, and it's made me more compassionate to others who suffer for their own specific reasons.
Speaker 2:I don't even have to know what reason it is, but if somebody's suffering, I get it now right. I don't just say, hey, you're a man, stand up tall, face, it be a man. I'm not saying that at all. I'm saying, listen, I don't know, but I have compassion for you. I understand the depths of suffering that we're all going to go through, and it could be from losing your father or your wife or a child. It could be anything. You know, something that may seem trivial to some of us. It's painful, right, and it's really, and I think it made me softer with almost everybody. I see Now, when I see people that are angry or bitter or discouraged and want to put it on me, I have to ask myself something's going on right, something's happening for that person and I don't know what it is. Maybe they lost their wife, maybe they, I don't know but certainly if I can lend a compassionate hand, because I know what it feels like to be in pain, and I know what it feels like to suffer so deeply that you don't even want to live sometimes, right, I know what that feels like now, and so the ability to see that side of it, I think has made me just more compassionate to other circumstances and it's also really, I think, helped me.
Speaker 2:You read a lot of my stories and that's the way I cope, because I still suffer and I think I probably always will. But I feel like my suffering needs some sort of purpose. If I can write up a story and talk about how I'm going to try to come out the other side of it or work through this problem or see the glory in it or the happiness in it somehow, then I feel like maybe that's a way I can help other people and my suffering must have purpose. I'm not going to suffer purposefully, and so you know, I think that's a big part of it for me and that's why I do a lot of podcasts.
Speaker 2:Now, too, is somebody out there is suffering, somebody's gone through some tough stuff, man, and sometimes you don't know if you'll escape, and I've always so far, I've always escaped right, and I know. And as I look back on that suffering, now I can look at it and it's been an adventure, right. I mean, even suffering in itself can be a part of that adventure. It can be a memory that you look at and say I learned and I grew from that experience and that's hopefully what we want, right? We don't want to come out at the end of a problem and just say, oh, I hope that never happens again and I don't want to.
Speaker 2:And if that, right, we want to say what did I learn and how did I grow and who did I become through that experience? And hopefully it's somebody that's just a little bit better or a little bit more capable or a little bit more kind or a little bit more compassionate. And I think that's been the biggest thing for me is just realizing that I've been forced to grow through this process and it has made me and my kids closer. I've focused on them. She's not here for me to focus on anymore and she was all my focus, right, and so now I get to focus on them a little bit more, and so now I get to focus on them a little bit more and I think it's improved my relationship with my kids and it's given me purpose. She was my purpose, and now I have a different purpose, and that purpose is to help others, including my kids and anybody else that I can be helpful for.
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Speaker 1:It's amazing to see that you can go through what you went through and come out on the other side the way you have, and I'm sure that it did not come without a lot of suffering, without a lot of emotion, without a lot of questioning the universe, questioning life, maybe questioning God, who knows. But you have come out of it and I really do believe that by going on the podcast, by writing your posts every day or every other day, how often you write them, I love seeing them and when I see them even if I don't have, depending on how, sometimes I'm just scrolling for a quick minute and I don't always have time to read because sometimes they are pretty long. But if I see something and I don't have the time at that moment to read it, I always will take a screenshot of it and text it to myself so that I can read it later, because I want to make sure that I read it, because I love what you write. Not a lot of people can make that extreme of a switch. Some people are going to find a new purpose when they lose a spouse, some people can't. Some people are buried in their grief and don't know what the first step is. My wife jokes that if I die before she does. She'll figure it out after the first six months that she spends in bed. Yeah, of course, the same joke. She will always say that I have to outlive her because she doesn't think that she's going to be able to live without me. So of course I get to be stuck without her. So yeah, all right, I'll find I'll figure it out.
Speaker 1:Right, the whole purpose of this podcast is to well, there's two purposes. The first one is to give anybody who has a story to tell the opportunity to tell, to give that platform, because this isn't just because I'm the host of the show. The show is not about me. I made episode one about me and I did that very specifically because I knew early on if I was going to ask other people to make themselves vulnerable, to talk about the hardest shit that they went through in life. I should probably do the same, and it just didn't seem like a good idea to not lead by example, to kind of lead by do as I say, not as I do. It just didn't seem right, it didn't seem authentic. So, episode one I told my story, told all the shit I went through with my dad and losing him and what that was like my journey through therapy and the anger that I dealt with and how I process all that After that. It's not about me.
Speaker 1:I mean a little bit, I throw in a couple of stories here and there, but it is about talking to people like you, because there's so many people, as I've learned through the last few months of doing this podcast. There are so many people, men and women that love to tell their story, not because they love the grief aspect of it, but because it's helping so many others. But there are also so many people who don't know where to begin. They don't know how to have these conversations to begin. They don't know how to have these conversations.
Speaker 1:Luckily, I have spoken with a couple of people on the show who told their story publicly for the very first time on my show. It's a huge honor to be able to talk to anybody who's willing to tell these stories, that is. I can't even put that. I can't quantify that because I'll give an example. There's one lady who I spoke with. I won't mention names because she will be on a future episode, so I'm not going to give any spoilers at this point. She has her own podcast. She's been doing it for years. She's been helping people, but she has a story also that she had never told publicly. And she did for me and it was emotional, it was a wild ride for her, but she also knew that she needed to do it.
Speaker 1:I wish that everybody could find a path to tell their story, but it's just not the case. Some people feel like they don't have, whatever it may be, an avenue to tell or the person to talk to. Some people think that they're burdening others by telling their story and by dragging somebody down to the depths of their grief. What would you say to that? As somebody who's been through it, who's lost their dad, who's lost their wife, what would you say if somebody was in a similar situation and you figured out that they had things to talk about but they couldn't get started and you wanted to be that person for them? What would you say?
Speaker 2:I'll tell you what I did with my wife. I'll tell you exactly what I did with my wife because I think it saved me. And what I did with my wife was I like to write and I like to tell stories in writing, and you know any chance I get. But I was unafraid. I kept a diary almost every night for the first six months because a couple of years before she passed away, I remember I was having a conversation with my brother and he said what's your biggest fear, kyle? And without even thinking about it, I said losing my wife Shelly. Right. So when she passed, I thought holy crap, my biggest fear has come to reality. Right, I was at a place where she was my world, and so I knew that I needed an outlet, and what I did was every night, I'd sit in bed and I would write out stories about her.
Speaker 2:Maybe it was our first meeting or something we did together, or just thoughts I had, and I would just put my thoughts on paper, and sometimes those thoughts were painful, discouraging, heart-wrenching thoughts. And then I always and I still try to do this when I write. I always tried to write. How am I going to escape and turn this into something positive in my life. How am I going to? And I wouldn't. Sometimes I wouldn't finish that night writing. Sometimes I would fall asleep writing, right. But when I woke up I would go back to that and say, okay, how do I turn this from a tragedy into some sort of a triumph, right, how do I turn my pain and suffering into something that can benefit me? It was all about me, right? That's the productive narcissist in me, and I knew I needed to get those emotions out and get that pain out and put it on paper. But I never wanted to just leave it at that. I just didn't want to say I'm suffering, I don't want to live anymore. The end, right. I would say and you've probably seen this, whether you maybe not consciously, but in all my writing I'll say I was suffering, I was in pain. And then I thought you know what, maybe I can do this or I can move in this direction, or maybe this is a call for me to act a different way in this circumstance. And so what it did was it kind of gave me a map to moving from the pain and suffering I was having to. How do I project some sort of buoyancy and happiness into the world and I even wrote a book. I put them all into a book my diary for the first six months after she passed away and it's called Facing my Biggest Fear, and it's a free PDF that you can download from my website, kylejetzelcom. If you go there and go to free stuff, you'll see. It's the book about my wife and anybody who wants to download it can download it. I don't charge for it, it's free.
Speaker 2:I needed the time to do something about it. When you're in pain is right now. If you're going through a struggle and you think you know what, when this is all over, I'm going to write about it, or I'm going to tell somebody about it, or I'm going to do something about it after it's over. I didn't do that. I just I went to work. I had a.
Speaker 2:Every night I would sit down and I would. Sometimes I would get tears on my keyboard on my laptop, right, and I would just write, and I would. You know I told everything, from the story of when we met to you know, our wedding day things, to some of the everything around me. Everything in my home reminds me of my wife, to, I mean just whatever crossed my mind that I was struggling with. I wrote it down and then I wrote how I'm going to move forward with happiness and joy.
Speaker 2:Right, because ultimately, those that pass before us, they don't want us to be miserable. They don't really have a choice whether we miss them or not, because we are. But if we think somehow they're on the other side and they're going, I can't believe. Kyle did that to me way back when I don't think that even matters. I think my personal opinion is my wife and my father and all those who have passed before me are going. Man, I want to see him thrive. I know what Kyle's capable of Now. I really know what Kyle's capable of. Or Nick or whoever whatever plug your name in. I believe they're going. He or she has no idea of the potential that God and I see in them now and that is what they want. They're going.
Speaker 2:I hope that sucker just lives the greatest life ever. No-transcript wrong way, right? There's so much that we can look at and take away. The cool thing about life is we get to decide what things mean in our life. You know, if your father wasn't kind, you get to decide what that means. And maybe what you decide, maybe what you have decided up until now is I'm not good enough or smart enough, and you can change that meaning. Right now you can just say you know what. I really think. He wanted me to thrive and he just wasn't, didn't know how to handle that.
Speaker 2:Well, and I truly believe those who have passed before us, man, they are rooting for us to be happy and joyful and kind and do right, create a magnificent story, and I believe they're up there cheering us on, no matter how they acted in this life. I believe they're cheering us on. And if they're going to cheer us on, I'm going to listen to that crowd right when I'm doing the right things. I'm going to let it uplift me, and so I think a big part of it for me was just we're going to have to suffer, you know. But again, write it down, figure out how you're going to get through it, work through it. Start to work now and you'll find that you're able to get through it.
Speaker 2:I said, by the way, it doesn't ever go away. I still have moments. I'll wake up some. This past week I had a dream about Shelly and I woke up and I was just in pain. Yeah, I was just. I mean, I thought you know that feeling where you're just like I can't do it today. You know what the world will understand. People know of my stroke. You know what my kids will understand. My boss will understand If I just call in and I just lay in bed all day and I just wallow in my misery, they'll understand you know, and then I thought you know what?
Speaker 2:I don't want to do that all day long. Maybe I can do it for five minutes and maybe I can talk to God and just tell him to help me. And whatever it is you do, you know, do that. We're all going to visit that place, but we don't have to live there, right, let's visit, let's feel it for what it is, because we need to do that, we need to feel the storm. We need to feel the storm and it's okay to feel the storm and we need to let the storm pass naturally and we need to go back to trying to be who we want to be and who we think they would want us to be, and if the storm pops up again, feel it again. Right, there are going to be times where you're just going to have to feel it, but it's not going to be every minute of every day.
Speaker 1:No, it's not. It's not going to be all-consuming when it happens. It's going to suck, but it will pass.
Speaker 2:It will pass. Yeah, and the good news is, everything you've suffered through or faced so far, it's passed Right. And you're looking back on it and you're going how did I get through that? Well, you got through it. Whether you know how or not, I happen to know how I get through things because I'm a real planner and a mapper and do that kind of stuff. But either way, even if you don't know how you got through it, you did Right and you're going to be able to do it the next time. And guess what? I don't expect that I won't have any more difficulties in this life. I'm sure I will, Absolutely. Well, we all will.
Speaker 2:Right, it's part of it's part of the human experience to have those things happen. The question is how do we make it an adventure? How do we turn it into right? How do we write this incredible life story that people actually want to read? You know how cool is that to think that we got this. We're writing our own life story where we're the hero, or that we're the right, a triumph over tragedy, or a fantastic comedy or a drama that ends with whatever greatness. It ends with right. We get to be the authors of our own story, and a lot of it is based on the choices we make and what we focus on and what we pursue right and how we pursue it, whether that's, you know, through dread or angst or pain, or through happiness. You know we're writing the story, we're the lead author, we get to decide.
Speaker 2:We don't get to decide what happens, but we get to decide how we handle it.
Speaker 1:And that's really cool to me. It is all about the choices we make. They're not easy choices sometimes. Sometimes we don't even want to make the choice, we just want to let it go. We would just want to let it be like you said, just kind of drown yourself in it for a little while. And it's not that it's a problem to do that, as long as it's for a little while. Let the storm overtake you, if you need to. Let the storm pass, because storms do pass.
Speaker 2:And if you need to reach out and have lifelines, call people around you. You know, one of the greatest ways to get through anything is through human connection, right, that somebody loves you. Yes, and call people and say, hey, could you call me on Tuesday at three o'clock? And if they say why? I say because you know I'm struggling and you know what they'll do They'll call you Tuesday at three o'clock and they'll check on. People will, and you know what They'll. They will love that you ask them to do that. Yes, you will allow them to serve you in a way that it's just a call, right, there's so many ways to do that.
Speaker 1:It's not just a call To them. It might just be a call Right, but to you or to the person who is suffering, who's drowning in grief, it's not just a call, it is a lifeline.
Speaker 2:It is and pay attention to others. You know, sometimes the best way to get out of your own pain is to serve others is to look around you. People are struggling. Find somebody struggling, you know, go, take others is to look around you. People are struggling.
Speaker 1:Find somebody struggling, go take them an ice cream cone. Yeah, take them an ice cream cone, take them out to a movie, take them out to lunch.
Speaker 2:Simple. I have a son who's more severe on the autism spectrum and one day I was on an important call for work and I heard somebody knock on the door and he answered and he's very he's not very verbal and he's he's severe. So he's hard to understand a lot of. He has a lot of struggles with communication. And I heard a voice and I thought it was just one of these salesmen that goes door to door and it made me giggle to think they're trying to figure out how to talk to him because it's impossible, right, right. And then I heard him say chicken nuggets at McDonald's. I clearly heard my son say that. And then I heard him say chicken nuggets at McDonald's. I clearly heard my son say that. And I thought, well, that doesn't sound like a salesman. It doesn't sound like a salesman, not really. And then he. And then, when I finished up my call, I went and asked my son. I said and he couldn't, he can't even communicate with me very well Sometimes. I said, hey, who come to the door? He says I don't know. I said, was it a salesman? I don't know. So I started going through people that I knew in my neighborhood and I got to one lady. Her name is Angie. I said was it Angie? He said yep. I said it was Angie and he said yep. I said did Angie say can I get you anything? And he said yep. And I said did you tell Angie to go get you some chicken nuggets? And he said yep.
Speaker 2:Well, about 20 minutes later, angie shows up with chicken nuggets and a strawberry banana smoothie for my more severe autistic son. And I came to the door and she said hey, I came by to check on you guys. What Check on us? She's a neighbor that lives three or four houses down. She's friendly and we're friendly, but it's not like we're great friends. And I said what made you decide to check on us?
Speaker 2:She said I was just thinking about you and so I came down to check on you and I asked Eric if I could do anything. He said yeah, chicken nuggets. So I went and got us some chicken nuggets and I said you have no idea what that means to me. You're just checking on us. She says I knew your wife, I loved your wife. She knew. She said and I was thinking about you and I see you with your kids, I see you working hard. But I just thought I'd check on you and I'm like holy crap, man, who does that? Well, angie did it. She just thought how can I just? I don't know what she thought.
Speaker 1:Maybe she wasn't thinking, maybe she was just reacting. It was an outpouring of love.
Speaker 2:It was just an outpouring of love to our family from basically a stranger and I was shocked and, by the way, since then she knows what it meant to me. Now I mean she knows, because I was not going to let that go by without telling her. You can't know what it meant to me and my family. It's just beautiful. That is beautiful. And it made me think who do I need to go see right now? Who's somebody I need to stop in and check on right? And so I did.
Speaker 2:I went and checked in on somebody and they're like what are you doing? I'm like I'm checking in on you. They're like what? Like I was thinking about you. I thought I should check in. Thank you so much. You know, it's just it's people want to help us. They really do If we give them permission and say hey, could you check in on me in a week or so? Just give me a call or text me, see how I'm doing, because sometimes we can go down that rabbit hole. It's so painful, we don't know if we're going to escape, and it can be a text from a friend, it can be anything that saves us.
Speaker 1:It doesn't take much.
Speaker 2:It doesn't take much and we can be those people too. Maybe that's the challenge for this podcast. You're thinking of somebody right now and you're listening to this. Somebody popped into your mind. Call them up and tell them how much you love them, and tell them you're checking in. You want to make sure they're okay. Just do it and watch what happens. It'll make you feel better. You never know, right. You really never know. You never know.
Speaker 1:That's exactly what I've been trying to put out there with this podcast. I don't ever expect that I'm going to have a million listeners, and that's okay. I don't need to have 10 million listeners. What I need to do personally is exactly what I am doing. I need to feel like I'm helping people.
Speaker 1:I started this podcast because I wanted to help people. I've always had a buyer inside of me that just wanted to help people. I never knew how to do it, and after I found myself unemployed at the beginning of this year, a contract that I was on had ended and I had a little bit of time to think about what can I do. Of course, the first thing I was doing was trying to find a new job, but for the first time pretty much ever, I had nothing but time on my hands, and so I started thinking about what do I want to do, and the podcast is ultimately what I decided to do. But it wasn't about getting a huge listenership or making millions of dollars, like so many people think that podcasting is all about. That's not what it's all about. Sometimes it happens, but usually you have to either have a story that just catches fire or you have to have public name recognition, which I don't have.
Speaker 1:Hopefully people will know me at some point, but not for those kinds of reasons. I want to help people and I'm hoping that people hear these episodes, they hear these interviews and I hope it resonates with them. I hope that maybe some people will think about what they just heard and will think of another person who might be going through a rough time, might have recently been going through a rough time, or just maybe they'll think of somebody who this theme that this podcast would resonate with and tell them say, hey, I just caught an episode of this podcast. It's pretty decent. You might want to give it a shot. They talk about some things that you know they're not the sexiest topics, but they really resonate with a lot of what you might be going through and just give it a shot. And if people do that, all it takes is just tell one person and that one person tells one person and hopefully, before we know it, we've got something that maybe can help a lot of people. Because that's all I want out of this.
Speaker 1:I want everybody to have a community that they can go to, that they can turn to, where they realize that they are not alone in what they're dealing with or what they've dealt with the same way that you, I'm sure, needed something at a certain point after Shelly died, after your dad died. It's not just as simple as get out of bed, brush your teeth, put your shoes on, put your clothes on and go about your day. It is not that simple. It's not that simple on a normal day for people who have an experience loss. So I can't imagine what it was like for you for the last three years, and not just living your life without your person, but you've got six other people that you're responsible for. I just have a cat. She's a pill enough.
Speaker 2:I got to tell you, man. You just reminded me. The number one reason why I love what you're doing, nick, is you're doing what you just described and what you're doing the difference in the villain and the hero. Right, you're the hero. You've experienced something and you've said I really don't want other people to suffer like I did, right. So you know what I want to do. I want to start a podcast because I don't want the world to suffer. You could have gone the other direction Many people do, but I'm so grateful, nick, that you've decided to do this.
Speaker 2:There's so much to be had through connection with other human beings. I've got a good friend of mine who has a company called Connect and Conquer. I got a good friend of mine who has a company called Connect and Conquer, and it's about human connection, right, it's about you're not going to be going down too many rabbit holes. If you've got friends around, right, or you've got somebody love you that's checking on you. Make sure. We just got to make sure we reach out to those people that are around us and share our stories. Talk to people, make sure people know they're not alone. Make sure they know.
Speaker 2:When my wife passed away, I went through all the scriptures and I had read somewhere I thought it said you won't be given more than you can handle in the scripture somewhere. Well, I couldn't find it anywhere. It's not in there. It's some old wives tale or some lady made it up, and it's not in there. You will be given more than you can handle. I have been given more than I can handle and I had to turn to others, right To God and to friends and to family. And that's what you're doing, is you're giving people an opportunity to talk to each other and connect and say oh, you know what? Kyle's pretty normal dude, man, just average, everyday dude, like I am no special skills, I don't have any special skills, I don't have any. I'm average height, average weight, pretty much average, everything right, I mean, and he did it, I can do it right.
Speaker 1:The difference is the same way that you just said I'm the hero Now, I appreciate that and I know why you're saying it. I don't see myself'm the hero. Now. I appreciate that and I know why you're saying it. I don't see myself as the hero. I see myself as the guy with a podcast who's trying to help people.
Speaker 1:You just said you don't have any special skills. Well, clearly that's not the case, because look at everything you're doing, look at the lives that you've already changed. You've changed your own life, you've helped change your kids' lives, you going over and checking on your neighbor, and I'm sure a thousand other things that you haven't yet mentioned. You do have those special skills. We all have them.
Speaker 2:That's the point. Is we all have that simple, the simple skills right. If you can talk to another human being, you've got the skill right. That's the whole point, I think and I think that's what you're talking about here is where you know you don't have any celebrities on here. You don't have any, you know billionaires on here. That's not who we're talking about here, right? We're talking about regular people like you and me that are just living these regular lives and just trying to do the very best we can Right. And and just trying to do the very best we can Right. And I really do think I mean I'm so appreciative of you having me on, nick, because I know.
Speaker 1:It is my honor and pleasure.
Speaker 2:I know what it means, right, it uplifts me to be able to share the story and I'm hoping you know, if one person you know we've talked about this, you don't have to have a thousand downloads. If one person watches it and says you know what, if one person watches it and says you know what I can do better, I can figure this out. We win, everybody wins. We win One person, we win, and guess what I won today? Right, and you won today. I'm guessing. Hopefully you win today. That's right. There's two. There's two. Now we're just going to add to that, right.
Speaker 2:So, that's the whole point of it is. It doesn't take anything special, it's just right. Let's just all work together to uplift each other and work hard and try to figure this out together, because none of us are immune from the pain and suffering. And so don't feel like it's just you. It's not, you know. But also realize you've got all the skills you need to start running like a scalded ape right and to be the very best you can, you know, and to connect with the right people and to find those people that want to hear your story and that you can help as well.
Speaker 2:And if we all do that, man, we're just I, you know. I have people come over to my house and they say your house feels different and I say, yeah, it's because there's love and happiness and joy here. I'm trying to raise my kids that way so they can have it in their homes and spread it far and wide. You know, just one at a time, one person at a time, is all it takes, and that's what we're all pursuing. And if we pursue that together, man, you know, imagine you go to Walmart and you smile at somebody. They smile back and you say how you doing? They say I'm doing good. How are you? You don't have to know them, right? Yeah, it doesn't matter if you know them, yeah.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much. It's out there.
Speaker 2:That's right, that's right. Spread it, it's out there, definitely.
Speaker 1:Yeah, thank you so much, kyle. This has been incredible. I'm so grateful for you for coming on the show. I and I know that you've gone on other podcasts. I know that you've told your story and I'd love this story, and I hate that you are sharing this because you, as you say, so many other people could go the opposite direction. It could have just as easily happened to you.
Speaker 2:Just as easily.
Speaker 1:Yep, and I know that it wasn't easy to get to this point. As you said, you did suffer, you went through, as we've said before on the show, you went through the shitstorm of life, oh yeah, and I know that there are days when it's still not easy. Three years later, or how many years after since your dad has passed. It's not easy, but you do it every day and you've got your reasons for doing it. It's because you want to live a good life, because you want to have the best life for your kids, but also I mean, just look at you, you're such an amazing human being. You are changing so many lives and, by the way, I'm going to as long as you don't mind, before your episode goes live, but of course, by the time everybody hears it.
Speaker 1:I want to. I'm going to take your website and I also want to take the direct link to your book and post it on my website. I have a recommended page for podcasts and books and I want to put your book up there so that anybody who comes along and goes and sees all the books that are up there most of them are books that are for sale and it has the Amazon link or the Barnes and Noble link, or whatever it may be, but I think this is a huge resource as long as you're willing to share it, and I'm guessing you are, because you have it on your public website.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. Yeah, I'd love for you to do that, nick. You know you remind me of something I'm going to share. That, I think, is a great way to close this whole thing. It's.
Speaker 1:I had about. I've got one more thing that we're going to do to close it out, but okay.
Speaker 2:Okay, no, but you go first.
Speaker 1:I had a I had about I still dream about her pretty regularly.
Speaker 2:But this one stood out because usually, when I have dreams, I decide what they mean, because I've decided that's what I'm going to do and they're always going to be productive and helpful right, even if they seem like bad dreams.
Speaker 2:But this one, the message was very clear to me because in my dream I was at somehow, I found myself at the top of a hill and I looked down and there was a pedal car next to me. You know those little tiny pedal cars that kids play in. Sure, yeah, there was one of those sitting next to me and I looked at that hill and I looked at that pedal car and I thought I see some fun here, right, oh boy. So I hopped on the pedal car and I rode the pedal car down this hill and my hair was blown in the wind and I've got a lot of hair right and I could feel it blowing through my hair and it was so exhilarating right. And then, when I get to the bottom of the hill, I realize there's some little kid at the top of the hill who's missing a pedal car.
Speaker 1:Oh boy.
Speaker 2:And I got to drag this heavy pedal car back to the top of the hill right. So I grabbed the pedal car and I put it under one of my arms. And I was just going to start trudging up this hill and I turned around and there was Shelly standing in front of me, my wife, and immediately I fell to my knees and wrapped my arms around her and I said I can't do this alone. I'm just not capable. I don't know what to do. I'm lost. I miss you so bad. I just can't do it.
Speaker 2:And I looked up at her and she smiled at me and then I said how long do I have to wait to see you again? And she said just one day. And I woke up and I thought how beautiful is that message, right? I don't. It's not going to be 10 years or 20 years or 30 years, or however long it's going to be, or five years, it's one day. All I have to do is live my best life for one day. And guess what I can do? One day, right. And I woke up that day and I had a great day and I thought if I can just make it through today, because she said just one day, right. And the next morning I woke up and I thought, if I can just do it one day. And those days have started to stack and it's been almost three years since she passed away. But I find myself frequently when I'm going into the depths of health, when I'm feeling the weight of the world and all my kids and all my responsibilities on my shoulders and it's overwhelming.
Speaker 2:I say just one day just one day, and I can always make it through just one day, right. I can always do that, and it's really carried me through some of the most difficult times is I just got to make it through today, right, just today, and I know, I truly believe it was one of those messages that I was allowed to receive from her. It has really been a powerful thing for me, and no matter what's happening in our world, it's just one day, right, just one day, and those days are going to stack. We don't have to. We're not trying to change the world all at once. We just do one good thing, one little thing one day, and those things will work out for us in the long run. And so I didn't plan on sharing that story. It always makes me emotional. I'm not sorry.
Speaker 1:No, don't be sorry.
Speaker 2:I have to bite my nose, but I think that's an important thing to remember too when we go through these things. Is it's just one day right and anybody can do it for one day?
Speaker 1:just, it's just one day, right, and we can. Anybody can do it for one day. Yes, we can. Anybody can do it for one day. That's how we get through life, on the good days, on the bad days, one day at a time. That's an incredible message and I can't thank you enough for sharing that.
Speaker 1:We have reached the end of this interview, so now, to close it out, we're going to actually have a little bit of fun. This time, we're going to do what I typically do with every interview and well, I won't say typically, because I actually do this with every single interview. I am going to ask you some random questions. I have a list of questions on an Excel spreadsheet and I shuffle them every time. This is meant to close things out on a happy note. None of these questions are geared toward anything we just talked about. Some of them may seem like they might have something to do with it, but it's completely unintentional. It's just meant to have a little bit of fun. You up for it, I'm up for it. Yep, let's go. All right, let's see what we can do, what never fails to make you laugh. Fart humor. I love it, that really is amazing.
Speaker 1:What is a lesson that took you a long time to learn?
Speaker 2:You know what I just recently learned? And I'm 58 years old. Are you really 58? Yeah, I'm 58 years old. Yeah, wow, thank you. You didn't say it, but I appreciate it. I know what you mean.
Speaker 1:You know you did say earlier that you have a 30-year-old, but still you don't look 58.
Speaker 2:So one of my favorite quotes growing up was for every trial or tragedy or difficulty we face, is the seed of equivalent or greater value.
Speaker 2:And after my wife passed away that made me mad. I had believed it my whole life, but that made me mad. Recently I saw the quote again and I read it differently and it said for every trial or challenge or difficulty we face, is the seed of equivalent or greater value. And I saw that word seed and I realized the seed is not a full grown bloom, it's not an apple, it's not a tree, it's beginning right. And so I realized my job is not to try to experience something that is equivalent, experience joy that's equivalent to the pain I'm suffering. My job is to pursue, is to nurture the seed of those things right. And so it changed me because now I can nurture, I can do things that nurture the seed. I don't have to experience some sort of joy that is equivalent to the pain, I can just nurture. And so now it's changed my perspective because I'm always looking for ways to nurture that seed and that's made me very happy, and I just recently learned that.
Speaker 1:That's a great lesson. Thank you for sharing that Okay.
Speaker 2:Say something cool. My son, my oldest son, has a little company where he makes t-shirts and he made me a t-shirt recently that says on the front, across the front of it, says give us this day our daily buckets. And it refers to basketball. Right, he took a scripture and turned it into a basketball quote. Because I love to shoot baskets, I shoot. I probably spend 10 hours a week in the gym shooting basketball and my kids tease me, they call it, my girlfriend's what they call it, because I'm, if I'm not at home, I'm over shooting basketball and to me it's a way I escape the world and get some exercise at the same time. And it's really cool to me because we all need that. We all need a little bit of an escape. So that's the way I escape and I like it because I get to meet a lot of people while I'm shooting basketball and that kind of stuff. So that's kind of cool to me. And the t-shirt it's one of my favorite t-shirts because of what it says.
Speaker 1:That's pretty cool. Yeah, definitely. Did you ever believe in Santa Claus?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I did, and I think it was we used to. We had a little shed outside our house when I was a kid and I found the gifts a couple of weeks before Christmas year. Oh no, yeah, and yeah, I stumbled across them and didn't cross my mind that it wasn't and I went in and said there's something wrong. And they said what I said there's a bunch of boys in the shed. And then my mom had to come clean on me. I might have been eight or nine, for some reason around that age. I wasn't the smartest kid.
Speaker 1:No, we all had our moments. Yeah, I wasn't the smartest kid. No, we all had our moments. I mean, I know we all had that point in our lives, those of us who experienced Christmas and Christmas presents where we realized actually, I guess technically there wasn't a Santa Claus. But I've always said that I like to believe in the spirit of Santa Claus and just the spirit of Christmas.
Speaker 2:I love it, that's what my mom called it. She called it the spirit of Santa Claus. I will tell you this I got a cool Christmas story One year. My dad was out of work. He had zero money, okay, and he made all of our Christmas gifts and he made me and my brothers a foosball table out of dowels and little pieces of wood and he built it and I'll never forget that Christmas. I remember more than any other Christmas because it was different and it was the adventure. Right, yeah, we thought we were getting nothing, we thought we were getting absolutely nothing. For Christmas. We got a foosball table that my dad built. How's that for a memory? I don't remember any other Christmas but that one and isn't that cool that? The one that where he put his own time and effort, is the one I remember the most Because it was different. It's the adventure, that was the adventure, and so, yeah, that's cool.
Speaker 1:I know the answer to this question Money or happiness.
Speaker 2:Happiness. My dad used to say you can't buy happiness, but it can put you in a nicer home while you search for happiness. That's right.
Speaker 1:Definitely, that's right. What is your favorite word? Oh, shoot. Yeah, I know I didn't tell you about this in advance. You didn't have a chance to study.
Speaker 2:I'm thinking. It's probably a word that makes me laugh. My son the other day called somebody a fruitcake and it's been stuck in my brain since and I haven't been able to. So I would probably have to say fruitcake when describing a person. And I haven't been able to, so I would probably have to say fruitcake when describing a person. Okay, that's fair, because when you picture a fruitcake, I don't know what you picture, but I just picture this goofy individual. I don't know what I picture, but I've been laughing ever since. Every day, multiple times a day, I'll giggle because I think of fruitcake Somebody's a fruitcake.
Speaker 1:Somebody's a fruitcake. The world is full of them. It a fruitcake. Some of it is a fruitcake. The world is full of them. It is. What do you think people misunderstand?
Speaker 2:about you. Oh shoot man, you know I'm such an open book I don't know that they misunderstand a lot. Maybe I hide my suffering a lot of times. I'll talk about it. So I think people know I do suffer, right, but I think I'll write about it. So they know I suffer, I'll write about it. So I think they know I suffered.
Speaker 1:But but I am, I'm buoyant, 99.9% of the time I'm pretty happy.
Speaker 2:Okay, and it can be a little overwhelming for people. I think so yeah, but I can back off if I need to. My wife taught me how to back off a little bit.
Speaker 1:Fuck them if they can't take a joke.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Sorry, I know that's a little harsh, but no, hey, let the lovers love and the haters hate. Be who. You are right, that's right.
Speaker 1:Absolutely right On a scale of one to 10,. How much do you enjoy garlic?
Speaker 2:Oh, I'm probably in the middle somewhere. I like it, I like it in my salsa, I make homemade salsa and I like it on my pizzas and all that kind of stuff. So I'm probably a six or seven in that area. Yeah, more than your average.
Speaker 1:Well, I will say this if you ever find your way to Tampa and if you ever end up having dinner at my house, and if my wife makes you something Italian, she's going to probably use a lot of garlic. So Okay with me.
Speaker 2:Yes, that's okay with me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we are definitely a very garlic friendly house.
Speaker 2:We've got it in our fridge right now.
Speaker 1:What is your favorite junk?
Speaker 2:food. You know what? I have two vices when it comes to junk food. Tell me Donuts.
Speaker 1:What flavor donuts?
Speaker 2:Well, there's a guy around the corner from either here that makes a chocolate frosted bar with a piece of bacon on it. I know your head just exploded, didn't it?
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh, it did a little bit. It might be a minute I have to clean up the pieces. Holy hell, chocolate donut with bacon on it.
Speaker 2:It's got a bar of bacon laid across the top of it. He'll fry that bacon, and so I don't buy them. My kids for my birthday every year, instead of buying me a cake, they buy me donuts, and we do donuts now for my birthday. The other one is I like ice cream and I have been known to. I don't do it as much as I used to because I just don't buy ice cream, because I'll eat it every night, fill a big, giant cup of ice cream and pour milk in there and just slosh it around until I make myself a shake. The problem is I do that at 11 o'clock at night, which is probably the worst time of all to do it. So ice cream and donuts are if it's around, I'm eating it. I can't resist, so I don't try to keep it around. I like to keep it around.
Speaker 1:This isn't the next question on the list, but it does come up every now and then. So since you brought up ice cream, I'm going to ask what's your favorite flavor?
Speaker 2:I like a little mint chocolate chip.
Speaker 1:I like the mint chocolate chip.
Speaker 2:Yep, specifically Breyers, because it's white, it's a white. And then the chocolate chips on there are nice and chocolatey. Yeah, that's my favorite.
Speaker 1:What item is worth spending more money on?
Speaker 2:Basketball shoes. I have a wall of basketball shoes out there and my kids give me trouble, but I play so much I shoot every day. I'm not going to put bad shoes on my feet if I'm going to play every day.
Speaker 1:Take, care of your feet, take care of your knees.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, to me that's yeah. And shoes in general, I think, because you can mess up a complete outfit if you wear junky shoes. What is your favorite movie genre? You know what? I didn't realize this until my kids brought it to my attention, but I'm a Vengeance movie fan. Two of my favorites are the Count of Monte Cristo. I'll watch that anytime, and I'll also watch Gladiator at any time, and I hear a new Gladiator movie is coming out. My son was showing me. It's supposed to be pretty good. Gladiator 2 is supposed to come out soon. I haven't heard that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and both of those are vengeance movies. I didn't realize they were vengeance movies until my son said you really like vengeance movies, don't you? I'm like oh, I guess I do, but I guess I didn't see it like that. So that's action. Yeah, I like me some good, grand action.
Speaker 1:Nice. Well, there you go, breaking news right here in the podcast. There's going to be another.
Speaker 2:Gladiator movie yeah, and Breyers can sponsor this podcast.
Speaker 1:And Breyers should be sponsoring this podcast and the donut shop should too.
Speaker 2:Both of them should be, because I know my mouth is watering talking about it. I'm sure other people's are too.
Speaker 1:I'll tell you look, I am looking for sponsors for this show. If your friend with a donut shop wants a sponsor, tell him to get in touch with me. I mean well, first of all, does he deliver?
Speaker 2:You know what? He was my next door neighbor for years, across the street from me, and at the end of the day, if he had leftover donuts he'd bring them to my house when I had a bunch of little kids. But he won't deliver now I'll have to drive over and get him.
Speaker 1:I guess what I should have asked is do they do mail order? I don't even know if you can mail order donuts. I don't know you can mail order some things, but I don't know if donuts are one of them.
Speaker 2:I bet if you hunt around town you can find a chocolate bar with a bacon. I don't think he's the only one that does that.
Speaker 1:I've never seen bacon on a chocolate donut.
Speaker 2:It's worth it to get a chocolate bar and then just put your own bacon on it too, if you can't get it somewhere else, right? I mean, geez, louise, I know what we're having for dinner tonight, bro. I'm telling you right now. I know what we're having for dinner.
Speaker 1:I'm going to get on the scale and I'm going to weigh 10 pounds more than I did this morning just by thinking about this. Anything with chocolate and bacon. I mean, those are two of my favorite food groups. There you go, and they are food groups. Chocolate is a food group, bacon is a food group. I don't care what anybody says, I'm with you, I'm with you.
Speaker 2:What is the name of the street you grew up on? I grew up on Oak Cliff Boulevard. Oak Cliff is a inner city, a little area, a neighborhood in inner city Dallas, which, if people are from Dallas, when I meet people from Dallas and I say I'm from Dallas and they'd say what part? I'd say Oak Cliff and they'd say oh, and that means because it's a bad neighborhood. So yeah, and I grew up on Oak Cliff Boulevard, right in the middle of Oak Cliff. Yep, last question.
Speaker 1:It could be an easy one, it could be a deep one. How do you want loved ones to remember you?
Speaker 2:Oh man, I yeah, I know that I've written that out Right I want, I want to be like my dad. I want to leave a wake of happiness everywhere I go, and I want, when people look at my life, I want people to be like to people to say and my family specifically to say you know what, though, the world is a better place because Kyle was here. Yeah, that's really what I want, yep.
Speaker 1:It's a great legacy to leave Kyle. I cannot thank you enough. This has been wonderful.
Speaker 2:Thank you, Nick. That's been a lot of fun. I appreciate it.
Speaker 1:It really has. This has been a great time no-transcript.
Speaker 1:So generally, you're just a Facebook guy, right? Yep, I'm going to put your Facebook link out there. I will put your website out there. I'm going to make sure that everybody sees your book and I'm going to do that because everybody should be seeing your posts. They are inspirational, they're thoughtful, they are emotional, but they're you and that's the best part of them. And I know some people are going to see a few of them and say, oh, my God, I can't read this much all the time. Yes, you can Stop being a bitch, you can read them. They're great posts. People are going to give me a hard time because I just said that.
Speaker 2:I love it.
Speaker 1:I love it. Suck it up, that's right. Read the post. You'll read, you'll smile and you'll be glad that you did. Thank you so much. This has been wonderful. I really appreciate your time, your willingness to do this, and I hope that we continue the conversation after this.
Speaker 2:Sounds great, Nick. Thanks so much.
Speaker 1:Kyle definitely did not disappoint today. From losing his dad to losing his wife, to raising six children on his own, he has lived one hell of a life. The fact that he has been able to find so many ways, on his grief journey, to honor the memories of his lost loved ones and keep such a positive outlook is truly inspiring. I want to thank Kyle for appearing on the show today and I strongly encourage you to check out his website, kylejetzelcom, and download the free ebook that he mentioned during our interview. You can find the link in the show notes and on Kyle's episode page of OurDeadDadscom. If you have a story of grief and loss to share and might want to be considered as a future guest of Our Dead Dads, go to OurDeadDadscom, go to the Contact Us link and then select Be a Guest, fill out the form, send it in and you just might be able to tell your story and carry on this mission of helping ourselves and so many others.
Speaker 1:Again, there are no rules to navigating grief and there's no timeline for doing it either. Everybody needs to go at their own pace, but the most important part is taking the very first step, whether you want to tell your own story or you just want to listen to others tell their stories. The most important thing to understand is that nobody is alone in grief or should ever feel like they don't have someone who will talk or listen to them. Here at Our Dead Dads, within the safe space of this community, you always have both. Thank you for listening, and join me again next week when I am joined by my friend, eric Perignoli, as we take a ride on another emotional rollercoaster.
Speaker 1:When Eric talks about losing his father at six years old and how he has tried for much of his life to avoid confronting his grief head on, though keeps finding a way to poke the bear. Now, as Eric approaches becoming a grandfather for the first time, he faces reality and acknowledges that he can't outrun his grief any longer. Make sure you are listening to Our Dead Dads on your favorite podcast streaming platform, because you will not want to miss this episode or any other upcoming episode. This is Our Dead Dads, where we are changing the world. One damage soul at a time. See you next time.